They have broken up with Gateway so they should have their own thread.
We bought and sold a couple dozen Ultra Light Raging Inferno Nike Plastic DTs. I'm curious what you think of them. For low power players, like my wife, these seem to be the real McCoy. On the football field today I was getting good D but not better than the Rogue. Not worse either. Right around 380. Except, left handed, I was getting excellent results. Left handed I'm a low power kind of guy, but my good lefty throw went 321. Lefty I'm rarely topping 300, and then usually only by accident.
I'm looking forward to throwing one in reasonably calm conditions side by side with my other long drivers.
I was annoyed at myself today when I took the ultra light out to test it, there are a couple of bubbles in the flight plate that I wish I had noticed when picking it out Sunday. Anyway, I threw it alongside my new Rogue, and FLX Surge. The Surge and Rogue were trading places for distance, but the Ultra Light Raging Inferno Nike Plastic DT was defintiely getting out about 60 feet more. I am not a consistent thrower and the Surge and Rogue had low flights, while the Raging Inferno had a lot more height. I think I need to work with it more to get used to the lightness of it, but initial tests were excellent.
Quote from: bruce_brakel on April 23, 2007, 04:18:10 PM
They have broken up with Gateway so they should have their own thread.
Are you sure?
Am I ever sure of anything? It is what KVN said. They ground Gateway's name off their disc molds.
QuoteThey ground Gateway's name off their disc molds.
They should. I don't know what kind of miscommunication they had about what Quest was releasing, but what the GDS players said about the Quest releases was awful. I don't know what GDS was thinking, that they could bad-mouth thier partner and everything would be okey-dokey?
Probably it was the other way around. Probably they began bad-mouthing Quest when Dave let them know they were breaking up and they should start bad-mouthing Quest.
Quote from: bruce_brakel on April 24, 2007, 09:29:22 AM
Probably it was the other way around. Probably they began bad-mouthing Quest when Dave let them know they were breaking up and they should start bad-mouthing Quest.
Gateway players are still playing with Quest discs, and at this point, Quest is still making custom discs for Gateway (Diablo DT), and Dave at Gateway is still selling Quest discs. Any bad mouthing from their players, was done on their own accord.
Plastic politics aside, I can't wait to get out there and test throw Becky's and Maddisen's new Quest discs.
Quest has some really great stuff out there right now. I've been throwing the Inferno as it has turned into a really good distance turnover disc for me. For me (not the case for everyone I know) it is a longer Roadrunner.
The Ultra-light Raging Inferno DT is unbelievably cool. I won mine as a CTP from leagues and I can't believe how resistant that thing is to turning over unless I purposefully do so.
I haven't tried it out yet, but I see some interest in the Crossfire as a pretty good putter, and they have a new disc coming out in the relatively near future called the Laser. That disc looks to be very cool as well.
That's cool that you're carrying that line now Bruce. I carry Quest as well now and will have them with me at the tournament this Saturday in Highland Park. You should see some of the dyed work on the discs as well! It's much better than what you would see on an I-Dye or Fly-Dye from Innova or Discraft.
-Scott
KVN does the dye work, apparently. I don't know where he would have learned to dye discs. :rolleyes:
I was throwing a 166 Laser yesterday. It flies nice and straight. It does not have the D of the UL RI DT [it is not right to give a disc six names!] but it is easier to control.
I don't know how much of their line I will carry, but the Raging Inferno DTs and Crossfires have something that is not just a gimmick.
The Lazer that Quest is currently in the process of getting approved is more of a control/fairway driver than a long distance driver. Soon Quest hopes to have a full line of Lazer discs, varying in distance (100 M, 200 M, 50 M etc.) similar to a set of Irons from ball golf.
KVN gave me a 170g Raging Inferno a short while ago. I had not had a chance to throw it. Being the prototypical low power thrower I was interested to see what it could do for me. I took it with me to Lippold today and threw it as a second drive on a number of holes and threw it for a while on the soccer field. It consistently got at least as much and often more distance than anything else I threw. I got a much longer high speed turn with the Raging Inferno. I pulled them a bit to the left (I'm a lefty) but did not burn it. I think this will stay in my bag for a little while.
I threw the ultra light thing that KVN had given to Damon and even with my puss arm and throwing it with a hyzer release I still turned it over. I didn't care for that one.
was it the ultra light inferno or the ultra light raging inferno dt? It's really tough to get the UL raging inferno dt to turn over unless your arm angle is really high on it. I could see the ultra light inferno turning pretty easy since the heavy inferno can be turned without a lot of effort.
I let a woman try Diana's UL RI DT this evening at Baycourt. She was used to having to turn over some heavy overstable disc out of her boyfiend's bag and she turned over the ultra light. On her second try she backed off the oversteering and got a longer throw. I wish I had had some to sell!
If you have been throwing drivers that are too overstable for your power, you may have developed some bad form habits. Brett, with his power, threw one about 400 feet. He throws with excellent form, but he doesn't throw 400 feet.
Bruce, it's nice to see you only carrying only the good discs that Quest makes. They really do have 4-6 really strong offerings and about a bazillion plastic paperweights. By only offering discs that add value, you are really helping out the players that are leary of trying a new company in the first place. You are also doing Quest a huge solid by only putting out discs that will get them a good rep and staying away from the discs that could easily slot them as a novelty company.
Having Quest as local is cool too. People really seemed to dig having a factory rep (KVN) there to demo the discs and let them try them out. He was doing a great job of sending people to the merch table to purchase.
I gave my dad a 135 UltraLight Raging Inferno DT yesterday. We went out to Washington Park. It's a wide open course similar to Fairfield. He had been using 150 Leopard & Valks for his primary driver. He was easily throwing the Inferno 30 to 50 feet farther than his other drivers. He birdied hole #2 with it. I don't think i'll be getting that disc back ;D.
I liked the D of the ultralight RIDT I have, but not the controllability. So I ordered a 150 Orion LF. Got the D I expected from the weight, but behaves almost identical to the 168 I throw everyday (much more accurate). I'm wondering what other discs would fly well at much lighter weights.
Unrelated: I walked into Walgreens on Aptakisic in Buffalo Grove and almost tripped over a Quest display. Seems like everywhere I go, I see their discs. If you want an Ultralight, they had a bunch there and there's a bunch at the Marathon by Fairfield.
The Newest Addition to the Quest line of golf discs is the:
"Rock-It"
It is a very stable mid-range/approach disc for that nice up shot, to set up for par. You can even go for the deuce and putt with it.
Very nice disc.
I will be giving one away at Grip It and Rip It in Roselle on Saturday.
Here is the link for a picture of the Rock-It:
http://www.questat.com/NEW.html
heh, I can't say I'm a huge fan of the hot stamp - makes me think of "guitar hero meets disc golf", but the disc looks promising. I saw in another picture that it has the Dimples too. Will have to try this one out too and see what happens :)
your highland park stamp was in disc golf world news on a quest/gateway advirtisment
if i go back to work soon i might be interested in a couple of those funky baskets
the Highland park stamp is in the inside cover of the new issue of Disc Golf World too, awesome :)
I bought the Raging Inferno and Raging Inferno DT awhile back and didn't like them at all. Since then my driving style has changed a little bit so maybe I can take them out once more to see how they fly. I tried selling them earlier but I never really followed through with that.
On another note, I did try a few UL Raging Infernos and those things are just hilarious. It's true, they burn out way too easy. It takes a certain finesse to get them to fly more or less straight and it took me a few practice throws to get it down. I never laughed so much while throwing a disc. It takes absolutely no effort to get them to fly so so far. If you put any effort into it you will burn it out. Unfortunately, I left one of my UL discs in the back of my car with a book on it, and the book flattened out the dome part of the disc. I figured "hey, no problem, I'll just leave it out in the sun like my old Aviar and let it get its shape back." WRONG! DON'T DO THIS WITH YOUR ULTRALIGHT RAGING INFERNOS! The thing melted on me. Literally. I'll have to take a picture for you guys. The disc looks like a warped taco shell with some holes burned through it.
The UL RI DT is awesome though, I agree. Not nearly as easy to turn it over but with enough snap it will definitely burn out still. I lost mine the same day I got it unfortunately. I was going to buy another one, but then I found a 150 Champion Valkyrie and it flies very similar so I just use that instead now. Maybe one day when I'm bored I'll get another UL RI DT.
What is going on with the Turbo-Putt? This is on Marshall Street:
QuoteThen, because of pressure exerted on the PDGA leadership by certain manufacturers, the approval was rescinded a few days later. In the meantime, Quest produced thousands of these beautiful, controversial oddities, all with "PDGA Approved," and "Approved on 6/5/07" molded right into the plastic.
You probably won't hear much about this until it's long over, as the PDGA does its best to keep the rest of us in the dark about how it reaches decisions (they roll over like little yappy lap dogs whenever big money snaps its fingers), but this could very well be the disc to burn the PDGA's dirty little conflict of interest fingers. Boy, I wish I were Quest's lawyer. Now that guy's got it made.
http://www.marshallstreetdiscgolf.com/proddetail.asp?prod=turbo%2Dputt%5Fsrp&cat=120
Does anyone know what is going on? If this is true, I guess we will find out a lot about Brian Graham's leadership in the near future. I've been wondering if we have a new PDGA, or just a new guy named Brian.
It's still on the approved list dated 6/26/07.
It's still on the Quest site with no mention of anything out of the ordinary.
???
This was posted today by official PDGA Cheerleader Chuck Kennedy on the PDGA message board:
QuoteDisc manufacturers had little to do with the reversal on the Turbo-Putt. The PDGA received several complaints from players (some who have posted on the topic) about this disc not being a "disc" and the issue was referred to the Tech Standards Committee for review and recommendation. It was pretty clear that those on the Committee, which does not have a manufacturer rep on it, felt that only discs with a uniform outside radius should be allowed. I believe the committee's views are in sync with what most feel is a fundamental characteristic in our sport - that the items we throw should be round "discs" on the outside. A recommendation from the Tech Standards Committee regarding this was submitted to the Board and the Board approved it. No sinister back story regarding manufacturer pressure.
If you want a disc some manufacturers have lobbied to disallow, consider the Epic. However, so far the disc has withstood the efforts of some manufacturers to try and disapprove it.
So, I guess it is true. Get your collectible Turbo-Putt today!
This really does not explain why the Tech Standards Committee approved it in the first place, but oh well.
Addition: I didn't read the whole thread. Later Chuck responded to the same question:
QuoteYes. It's primarily Jeff Homburg who just routinely tests discs based on the specs as written with little discussion other than copying the committee on which discs pass or don't pass the tests. It wasn't until the players brought up the question about whether a disc being round was fundamental to the sport that the discussion ensued to revisit the specs in this case.
So Homburg does all the work, and the "committee" rubber-stamps whatever he says. I guess it sounds more democratic if you give the illusion of a committee working on these things instead of the reality of one guy making all the calls.
Quote from: krupicka on July 07, 2007, 01:43:48 PM
It's still on the approved list dated 6/26/07.
It is still on the approved list. The PDGA must be dragging their feet, mostly because I don't think this has happened before. There is probably no protocol to follow.
they sure got the SL on the approved list on the site quickly enough... wonder how long it will take to get it off.
I really think the PDGA has blown it on this one. If Quest decides to sue they will win. By the PDGA's own admission the disc meets the loosely defined standards that are in place. Telling someone who has invested in the development of a disc, been given the OK to produce them and now has them out to the public that you have changed your mind because some of your members don't like them... ???
If I was the PDGA God, I'd let the Turbo-Putt go. It is a niche disc, it's not going to fundamentally alter the game. I've been playing for 20 years and I've used a turbo putt maybe a half-dozen times. This disc is not going to make me suddenly start going turbo putt crazy. Why let this disc get you dragged into court?
What I would do is change the standards so that the Turbo-Putt was the LAST disc without a consistent radius to be approved. From here on out, they all have to be round. No drawn-out lawsuit needed. As of right now, they have made the Turbo-Putt illegal and NOT changed the standards. That is a recipe for making Steve's lawyer a lot of money.
Yeah, I just read the standards doc & it doesn't say it has to be circular... just saucer-like and I know I've seen saucers in my life that have a scalloped edge.
I guess it just me, since there does not seem to be a lot of interest in this subject. However, I think the PDGA just stepped into deep do-do here. I'm not saying I like the Turbo-Putt...Hell, I thought the 10 M Brick should never have been approved, much less a flying saw-blade. I'm just concerned that the PDGA is making a power play here, but their own lax standards are going to get them ripped to shreds if they end up in court.
I really think they should back off and let Quest have the Turbo-Putt. Who is going to use it, really? I don't think this is the disc that makes Climo jump the Innova gravy train for Quest. The PDGA are the ones that have loose standards, so fix the standards so that we don't have any more of these. If they loose in court, they may loose the ability to restrict future designs.
Leave the Turbo-Putt approved, fix the standards so that it doesn't happen again, and stay out of court. What am I missing here?
Chuck does not know everything, and of course, neither do I, but I have good reason to believe that employees and shareholders of some of the manufacturers complained very loudly. You know, like they told me they did? ;D But those people would also be PDGA members so maybe Chuck is being clever.
I think an argument can be made that the Turbo fails some of the tech standards. Homburg did not use the actual circumference of the disc but the circumference of the smallest circle tangent to its outer points. And, the disc has multiple inner rims. The disc violates the assumptions that the tech standards are based on. It is like the winning pony at the New York Dog Show! He might have all the dimensions and lines of a Champion Golden Retriever but he's a pony, dammit!
As a lawyer, I don't see that Quest has much they could sue about. The actions of the committees are constitutionally subject to the approval of the Board. Quest is not going to find any Board minutes approving the Turbo, only a committee finding that the disc meets tech standards. The most Quest could sue for would be the few dollars of plastic in the few hundred Turbos they made, and KVN's time in producing them. That's not much to sue for. The Quest dude is too business smart to get drawn into that.
I think it is too bad the Turbo got nixed, if it did. I was looking forward to the square or oval shaped putter that would never roll away. :lol:
It would be best if they left it alone and updated the rules to prohibit clones. I'd be annoyed if a disc was legal when I bought it and then could no longer use it due to a status change.
In the end it doesn't matter, and I'm not trying to argue...BUT (which means I am arguing anyway) the disc was (actually still is strangely) on the list of PDGA approved discs, so I think the case would be fairly strong. The disc may or may not fail tech standards (since they are vague) but the disc WAS approved by the Tech Standards committee...which means it passed tech standards. You are right that it would amount to peanuts unless they were to get the disc reinstated, which I don't think a court of law can do.
From my standpoint if I was Quest I'd let it go because the disc was going to be a low volume niche disc anyway (its not like they de-certified the Inferno) and if you want to make a go of it in disc golf, the PDGA is the only show in town.
Steve Howle was in court with Innova all the time, but I don't think he ever sued the PDGA. He was all ticked off about being blocked from sponsoring the Worlds one year, but I don't think he sued. Anyway, that is the only other way to go. Lightning has divorced themselves from serious tournament players and goes 100% after recreational players. Given Quest is based on technology and the improvement of the golf disc, they have to target the serious tournament players. And that means playing ball with the PDGA.
How tied up the PDGA leadership is with Innova, Discraft, DGA and any other potential conflict of interest is a subject for another day. Chuck Kennedy I'm sure was being clever...Dave Dunipace is a PDGA member, so he can send in a ;) "player complaint" ;) can't he?
Anyway the whole thing just sent me off on a anti-PDGA rant, which really isn't that hard to do. I've been complaining about it for three days now, but really it is just a rumor. The disc is still on the approved list, there has been no formal announcement that I have seen from the PDGA, and despite what they announce (if they ever announce anything) is the general consensus that Innova flexed its muscle and had this disc killed. The de-certification of a disc is about unprecedented, yet it has not created any buzz amongst PDGA members. Heck, Hoeniger wouldn't have even needed to crash the message board due to the small ripple this has caused. Since no one else cares, I guess I'll drop it.
What thread was this anyway? Oh, yeah...Quest. Has anybody thrown the Rock-It yet?
Alright guys, here is the picture as promised.
This is why you shouldn't leave your ultralight out in the sun for too long. I don't know if the the other UL discs suffer the same fate as the UL Inferno, but I don't feel like finding out.
I dont know what you did to that frisbee roman but I have had over 50 quest drivers and none of them have even come close to that. Most of my quest discs hold their shape and flight pattern longer than the innova and discraft I used to use. I do not throw any ultra lights my self but I have some friends that use them and they have never had any problems with them. You might of got a bad mold or you just get really pissed off at your frisbees.
neal, a near the top of this page roman talks about how the disc got left in a very hot place & this is what happened to it.
Yeah, I left it in my car with a book on top of it and because of the heat the disc got all soft and the book flattened it out on the top. I left the disc in the back window of my car for a day to see if it can get back into shape and that's what it turned into. I've done this before with Aviar putters (heck, I still leave them out there for days to get them gummy sometimes) and they hold up just fine.
Just a word of warning, not bad mouthing Quest or anything :) I know some people that leave their discs out in their car in the sun and I'm just saying that they shouldn't do that with the Ultralight Infernos. I have a regular RI and RI DT and they're just fine in the heat.
It's a shame, too. This happened only 2 days after I bought the disc.
The PDGA site just posted an announcement on the Turbo Putt
http://www.pdga.com/documents/2007/Turbo-PuttAnnouncement.pdf
and for those of you who just want the summary and not want to have to read the whole thing:
- The Turbo Putt will lose PDGA approved status on 12/31/08.
- Requirements will be updated to state that any new submissions for PDGA approval must have a round outside edge.
- QuestAT has to remove "PDGA Approved" from the mold immediately.
- QuestAT forfiets the rights to sue the PDGA.
Most notably not mentioned was that there are no restrictions against the swirl pattern under the flight plate, so if I was Steve at Quest there would be a pretty simple alternative to the Turbo Putt design that could more than likely be used just as effectively...
I read the agreement and it seems pretty equitable on both sides.
Good work by Brian Graham. If Brian Hoeniger was still at the PDGA, this could have been a boondoggle.
Quote from: Uncle Sam on September 11, 2007, 01:43:37 PM
Good work by Brian Graham. If Brian Hoeniger was still at the PDGA, this could have been a boondoggle.
Brian Graham, Brian Hoeniger...eh, different slices of the same pie. Who do you think taught Brian Graham how to do what he does?
Quote from: stpitner on September 11, 2007, 11:46:16 AM
- QuestAT has to remove "PDGA Approved" from the mold immediately.
Actually, I read that to mean that they can't produce any new runs of the turbo putt in its current form. They can sell out their current stock and not produce more since it will lose its approved status at the end of next year.
So will the Quest Turbo then become like the steel pennies? Will this goofy little gear like erzatz putter become a collector's item? Also, should we have a PDGA approved one disc Turbo tournament on New Year's Eve next year? O0 It would be amusing.
Quote from: mirth on September 11, 2007, 02:07:07 PM
Quote from: stpitner on September 11, 2007, 11:46:16 AM
- QuestAT has to remove "PDGA Approved" from the mold immediately.
Actually, I read that to mean that they can't produce any new runs of the turbo putt in its current form. They can sell out their current stock and not produce more since it will lose its approved status at the end of next year.
They can produce more just not with "pdga approved" stamped or molded on them.
yeah, I don't think there's any way that the PDGA can *make* Quest stop producing a product, but they CAN make them stop producing it with the PDGA Approved wording on it though... it just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to Steve to continue making the Turbo Putt once the grace period has ended anyway though.
Another item that was in that posting was that it sounded like the Turbo Putt was going to be modified so that it does fit within PDGA spec. If that is true, it will be interesting to see what it will look like.
I thought the best part of design was the bottom swirl. It allows for a support point for your thumb. Saw blade or no, so long as they can still make a disc with that swirl feature it will still be a major improvement in the grip for that shot.
Not enough to make me carry one, though.
Any idea when Quest AT will be making a "legal" circular disc with the swirl engraved in the botton of the disc. I wonder if they wait until next year after the turbo putt loses its PDGA approval..
???
http://www.questat.com/NEW.html (http://www.questat.com/NEW.html)
I'm not sure if this is actually inteneded to be a golf disc, or if this is inteneded to give Jeff Homburg a heart attack.
At least it's round! ;D
Steve brought this out a few weeks ago. He threw it ( 2 finger flick) & it rolled like a wheel. Very interesting.
I think it is designed to have no net lift. It is an idea I mentioned to Discraft years ago, and to KVN last year. Probably KVN never mentioned it to his boss though. That guy is a whacky genius! ^_^
If you are looking for some all around whackiness this is a great video to watch. Local sensations Neal Swanson & KVN are mentioned. It's amazing Quest has been so successful in the disc golf world ;)
http://www.questat.com/#page-9&page=page-9