I'm just throwing it out there that this event date is being moved (most likely AUGUST 14/15). My wife and family aren't happy nor was the Parks Department thrilled but if that's what it takes then that's what I'll do. I never wanted to 'compete' with IOS event because there are more than enough players to go around but this way it can't even be considered an issue.
HOWEVER ... Whomever was removing this event thread simply because of a date conflict - needs a lesson or two in message board etiquette. Removing a completely harmless thread simply because it doesn't coincide with your schedule is not the appropriate way to handle it.
I have read some pretty senseless, useless, ridiculous, demeaning, hurtful and just plain old stupid stuff on this very message board through out the years and to see that remain while a 'conflicting' event thread gets removed is all too sad.
As far as I'm concerned, this is all behind us. I plan to put on a great event at a course that many people really seem to enjoy. I hope you all consider coming up to play at the Grin & Bear It, PDGA C-Tier at Fox River Park in Silver Lake, WI.
Updated flyer attached to this message.
Thanks!
(Here I simply removed the OLD flyer, and will post Version 3.1 later in thread)
I once ran a tournament that conflicted with a TADGA tournament 90 miles away. There was nothing I could do about the date. The owner of the course said you can do it on this date, or not at all. So I ran my tournament opposite theirs.
But I did not advertise my tournament on their website! ::)
Thanks for running a tourny at Silver Lake Terry looking foward to it. I see it says 14th or 15th Im hoping its on Sunday!!
Not only did I move the event date but I even emulated the IOS division structure so it is consistent with what you'd find for an IOS event in terms of the days each division plays. Personally, I don't love this structure but I guess the people have spoken so I'll give it a try.
What's also funny is that I've already had 3 or 4 people contact me and tell me they are disappointed it switched dates because now they can't play. Good stuff.
@Bruce - Hundreds of events have been shared on this board even when dates / days conflict. I was simply pointing out the deleting a thread simply because of a date 'conflict' is not the way to handle it.
Quote from: discpro99 on July 08, 2010, 12:48:18 PM
Thanks for running a tourny at Silver Lake Terry looking foward to it. I see it says 14th or 15th Im hoping its on Sunday!!
We should probably edit this thread and start over once the smoke settles.
Terry,
I repect what you've done over the years and appreciate it. It's a lot of hard work. You know as well as I there are more talkers than doers in this game. The majority of or club members have supported you over the years and still do. I finally have a good course that is close to home. Silver Lake is sweet! Glad you were able to find tha park ;)
I was definitely disappointed with the day of the event. I'd much rather play an event close to home than travel 3 days running an event.
The silver lake event topic was removed. Over the years we've never had this issue. Very few posts have been removed or even edited. Think about it in a role reversal. Say you were running a 2 day B-Tier 2 hours from your house on and awesome course and you were adding $650 to the pro purse. The area doesn't have a huge local player base. Half of your field will be filled with players traveling from Milwaukee. You schedule this event early in the year. Someone from the Milwaukee area decides they are going to run a C-Tier at Brown Deer or Dretzka. Would you allow them to advertise this event on the website you pay to maintain knowing that a majority of them will probably stay closer to home to play?
I'd recommend flipping what dates play the division sets as Aug 14/15 is same as IOS #6, and if you flip your division sets you'd have less conflict. IOS #6 is going to be in Joliet.
Are you guys f'ing kidding me? The only other possible date I can do happens to be ANOTHER IOS weekend? I didn't even bother to check because that was my only other choice and now I read this.
I guess I will flip flop the days so the whining might finally end.
Sorry for the outburst here but geesh.
Quote from: stpitner on July 08, 2010, 04:43:32 PM
I'd recommend flipping what dates play the division sets as Aug 14/15 is same as IOS #6, and if you flip your division sets you'd have less conflict. IOS #6 is going to be in Joliet.
Terry- thanks for the change in dates. Looking forward to a tourney round at a beautiful new course.
Quote from: discglfr on July 08, 2010, 04:51:28 PM
Are you guys f'ing kidding me? The only other possible date I can do happens to be ANOTHER IOS weekend? I didn't even bother to check because that was my only other choice and now I read this.
I guess I will flip flop the days so the whining might finally end.
Sorry for the outburst here but geesh.
Quote from: stpitner on July 08, 2010, 04:43:32 PM
I'd recommend flipping what dates play the division sets as Aug 14/15 is same as IOS #6, and if you flip your division sets you'd have less conflict. IOS #6 is going to be in Joliet.
That would actually be pretty awesome if the division days were opposite of IOS # 6. Peopl could play 2 tourneys in the same division on a weekend!
2 cents
I am looking forward to Grin & Bear It. Not crazy about a Wisconsin event with Bear in the title but oh well.
Quote from: discglfr on July 08, 2010, 01:33:29 PM
Not only did I move the event date but I even emulated the IOS division structure so it is consistent with what you'd find for an IOS event in terms of the days each division plays. Personally, I don't love this structure but I guess the people have spoken so I'll give it a try.
uber lame!!!!!! stick to the way you standardly run tournaments. they are already some of the best in the nation. dont copy a not so great style.
I don't usually chime in on things like this. I accept the work that TD's and volunteers do to run an event and greatly appreciate the efforts of all involved. This topic, unfortunately, disappoints me. Both parties involved are EXTREMELY respected in my mind. Both run outstanding events and have great player response from both Illinois and Wisconsin. I think Terry is offering an alternative to players who won't be able to make the trip for whatever reason. It's also an opportunity for some to play two events in one weekend. Did he realize it when he scheduled it? Not sure.
The event is (was supposed to be) on Sunday. It's unfortunate that "All Other Divisions" might not be able to make it, but there are other divisions that could play. It's a C-Tier event that is well within the rights of scheduling an event. I know there are many MA1 players that would probably like to play in both, but I would think the IOS will take priority for many. I'm sure Terry realizes he will miss players for this reason but was willing to continue with event.
I don't know if I have a specific "point" to my post other than thinking there's no reason an event can't take place. The TD understands they may lose players and it's his/her decision to continue with the event. I think the IOS organizers of this event are lucky that Terry is an understanding and nice guy to be willing to make changes with less than two weeks before an event. I was unaware of the changes until yesterday when I offered to be at the course this Friday to help with anythng that may need to be done. Now Carla will probably make me do house work after taking the day off work ;D
This whole thing makes me hesitant to post about an upcoming event if it's within a drivable distance for Illinois and Wisconsin players.
Quote from: Tom McManus on July 08, 2010, 05:58:19 PM
Terry- thanks for the change in dates. Looking forward to a tourney round at a beautiful new course.
...what Tom said. Played the alternate pins today and they're as entertaining (and often even more brutal) than the ones we played a couple of weeks ago.
If you sell mosquito netting at the merch table, though, you might make a killing! ::)
At 8pm EDT tomorrow I'll be announcing my commitment to either the Grin and Bear It, Indiana States, or the IOS event on a new thread titled The Decision.
I don't see this IOS 6 @ Joliet on the PDGA Tour page, is that date locked in? If all 3 of these events happen on the same weekend, the big loser is going to be the Joliet event. Lemon Lake's player base is largely the Joliet area players and I would predict a large percentage of them will be headed to Indiana States. Running a PDGA event in Joliet that weekend seems like attendance suicide to me.
I doubt Indiana States would significantly cut into the attendance at Silver Lake. In a perfect world I'd rather see Scott's Joliet event the next weekend Aug 21/22 where it would only be competing with a Saturday Milwaukee event. I don't think those 2 events would hurt each other much.
If I cannot rearrange my schedule to catch the announcement live, will you be tweeting? >:D
Quote from: Dan Michler on July 11, 2010, 06:53:00 PM
At 8pm EDT tomorrow I'll be announcing my commitment to either the Grin and Bear It, Indiana States, or the IOS event on a new thread titled The Decision.
Lemon Lake's player base is largely the Joliet area players and I would predict a large percentage of them will be headed to Indiana States.
Man, I hope more show up this year, than last year. Matt Travis is the only one I remember being there last year. I think something conflicted with it last year as well??
Quote from: Bruce Brakel on July 11, 2010, 07:22:05 PM
If I cannot rearrange my schedule to catch the announcement live, will you be tweeting? >:D
I think it's going to be a special on ESPN! ;D
Quote from: Jon Brakel on July 11, 2010, 08:11:41 PM
Quote from: Bruce Brakel on July 11, 2010, 07:22:05 PM
If I cannot rearrange my schedule to catch the announcement live, will you be tweeting? >:D
I think it's going to be a special on ESPN! ;D
Fortunately, there is no tournament in South Florida that weekend. Otherwise, i would expect all three TD's to cancel their events and play together down there.
Should probably get it off the pdga schedule for this weekend
Attempted that.
Besides all of the other work I've done for all of this, I did in fact contact the PDGA last week. Like everyone else, I KNOW for a fact that they are overworked and under paid and I see it hasn't taken effect just yet. I just sent them an additional polite reminder to please address it.
Funny, it seems that every few hours I'm now getting complaints about how it was re-scheduled away from this upcoming weekend.
I sure hope to see dozens and dozens of "IOS" contingency at this Grey Fox Course on August 14/15.
Terry
Quote from: discpro99 on July 12, 2010, 10:42:33 AM
Should probably get it off the pdga schedule for this weekend
Here is the latest flyer with the 2 or 3 different revisions all incorporated. Please sign up via mailing in one of these flyers with your info or by signing up online. LATE FEES start on Wednesday night.
Thanks!
I think scheduling problems like this would be better worked out behind the scenes. I think Terry would have received a different reception here if he had approached us before he scheduled it and explained why he needed to schedule on this date. I'd really like to work with Terry and other Wisconsin TDs on scheduling all of our tournaments but Wisconsin has not wanted to coordinate schedules with us. I'm not blaming anyone here. Wisconsin has their own tour and probably trying to get that nailed down is difficult enough without trying to mix in a neighbor state's conflicting dates.
The other problem with conflicting dates this year is the economy. We're seeing fewer people playing both days of split day formats all over the area and fewer people playing more than one tourney in the same weekend. In previous years attendance was not as much of an issue as it seems to be this year.
As a TD I try not to get too caught up in attendance numbers. I try to run the best tournament that I can and if people want to play then they will come. However, we do have fixed costs and a merch guy who has a more vested interest than I do. There's always a perception though that attendance equates successfulness so I think it's on the mind of every TD to some extent.
I think it would serve all of the tournaments and the players if we could schedule our tournaments around conflicts as much as possible. Communication is good.
Hopefully people won't take this instance of a problem with a conflict to mean that we are against Terry or his tournaments. This is not an "us" against "them" situation. If I could still play tournaments I would play Terry's tournaments whenever I could. I think a lot of you agree as we share the many of the same players. And that's why we TDs need to do a better job of communication before problems arise.
Quote from: Jon Brakel on July 12, 2010, 11:31:07 AM
I think scheduling problems like this would be better worked out behind the scenes. I think Terry would have received a different reception here if he had approached us before he scheduled it and explained why he needed to schedule on this date.
Jon,
There in lies the problem, I still believe my event wasn't a 'conflict' to begin with because as Sergio stated, I was outside the protected radius AND you guys have a very successful tour AND my event would gladly have taken anyone that wasn't eligible to play on Sunday's IOS. I still believe I could have filled without taking 'away' any Sunday IOS players.
Regardless, you are completely right in that had there been better communication starting back on May 22nd when I first started talking about a July 18th event I guess some of this could have been avoided. Lesson learned and no hard feelings across state lines!
It is all behind us now because I've picked a different weekend and made every possible effort to not conflict with the IOS world. I sincerely hope to see a ton of you at the event. From what I hear, it's all Illinois guys playing this course I've designed anyway :)
i want to make this clear - at no time did discontinuum or the ios request that terry change his date. i removed the tournament thread because it conflicted with a discontinuum sponsored event of $500. we appreciate terry moving the event and hope it works out.
Brett is dead on with his statement. It was a tough choice but in the end it was ultimately my choice.
Brett and Tom McManus were helpful getting this all situated and I do appreciate it.
Now let's quit talking and play some golf! Better yet, let's start seeing some registrations for all of these awesome events!
Terry
Quote from: CEValkyrie on July 12, 2010, 12:30:12 PM
i want to make this clear - at no time did discontinuum or the ios request that terry change his date. i removed the tournament thread because it conflicted with a discontinuum sponsored event of $500. we appreciate terry moving the event and hope it works out.
When do Pro Women play? They aren't listed on the flyer.
Well,
I was just copying the IOS info found on the P or P website and even after double checking it, I can't seem to find that they list pro women. Do they not even offer it?
Regardless, I made the decision just a few minutes ago with David Gentry on the phone to put them on the same day as the PRO MEN. Now you and Carla have to find a way to make it :)
Thanks for the heads up Serg. I will be posting yet ANOTHER revision of the flyer once I get it done.
Here is for Saturday: http://www.pdga.com/event?TournID=10748
Here is for Sunday: http://www.pdga.com/event?TournID=10800
Hey IOS peeps - do you guys not offer pro women?
Quote from: SERG on July 12, 2010, 03:57:52 PM
When do Pro Women play? They aren't listed on the flyer.
Quote from: discglfr on July 13, 2010, 08:09:01 AM
Hey IOS peeps - do you guys not offer pro women?
Quote from: SERG on July 12, 2010, 03:57:52 PM
When do Pro Women play? They aren't listed on the flyer.
The IOS split is MPO/MA2/MA4 on Saturday with all others (including FPO,MPM, etc) on Sunday. We have not had any pro women sign up for the IOS B or C tier events this year.
Quote from: discglfr on July 13, 2010, 08:09:01 AM
Hey IOS peeps - do you guys not offer pro women?
We offer every PDGA division as long as at least one player wants to play it! Since the PDGA started offering MA4 we have done MPO (men's pro open), MA2 and MA4 on Saturday; all other divisions on Sunday. Pro Women would be part of all other divisions. It looks like on the registration for IOS 5 Scott missed putting the division in the drop down box. Any women wanting to register should just register for MPO and in the comments can put in that they are playing pro women on Sunday. It's the same price.
Someone call Jesse Jackson
Anxiously awaiting registrations to come in :)
Current registrations for Saturday: http://www.pdga.com/event?TournID=10748
Current registrations for Sunday: http://www.pdga.com/event?TournID=10800
This event is (finally) taking place this weekend. In fact, the registrations have been a little slow but going after the Pro Worlds and going after The Mad City Open A-Tier, I can understand some waiting.
Trophies are being ordered in the next few days but it doesn't appear that I need too many at the moment.
LATE FEES WILL STILL GO INTO EFFECT ON WEDNESDAY NIGHT, AUGUST 11th. This gives everyone ample time to get a check in the mail on Monday or even Tuesday.
The plan is that you'll play one round with half the holes being short and the other round with all holes in the LONG placements. Saturday's layouts will be slightly different from Sunday's layouts. It is time we establish some official course records out there!
As always, contact me with any questions.
Thanks!
This course in Silver Lake is truly one of the best in the area for those who haven't played it.
Quote from: Dan Michler on August 12, 2010, 04:40:02 PM
This course in Silver Lake is truly one of the best in the area for those who haven't played it.
I agree with Dan on this one. If you plan on attending be sure to bring the bug spray. The mosquitoes are brutal up there. Still it is an absolutely beautiful course.
Dane and the rest of the Lifetime Disc Sports crew are extremely excited to have you all at the Grey Fox - Grin & Bear It C-Tier this weekend.
Countless conversations went back and forth about a month ago until I stood down and didn't conflict with the previous IOS event so I'm assuming I'll have nothing but full support for this awesome course and great event.
Thanks everyone and have a fun time setting the new OFFICIAL course records at Grey Fox this weekend!
Terry
Despite the low turnout this was a very fun event. Dane did a great job to keep everything moving and on a good pace. This course is the best course in Lake County and Kenosha County. Nice tee pads, great signs that clearly show distances, multiple pin placements, at least one par four and maybe two other holes that could be considered par fours, and a nice island hole.
Thanks to Terry and Dane for running this event. Thanks to Terry for his hard work in getting this course in the ground.