Vertical Plane

[CEValkyrie]

Jim,

     We discussed the vertical plane issue. Am I correct when I say that all vertical planes have been removed for the tournament & fall league?

[mirth]

Hmm... I seem to remember that the tennis courts were still off limits due to safety, but I could be wrong.



As far as the roads are concerned, I clearly remember the consensus being that over the roads is fine, as long as you come to rest within park boundries. This includes the shoulder on the South side of YorkHouse, but landing on the North side of the road is now OB.

[mirth]

wait, so the road on 5 (crete or otherwise) IS a plane? sucky.

[mirth]

Oh, and one rule for all divisions... It sends the wrong message otherwise.

[mirth]

I agree with Brett and Bill about needing consistency regarding OB VP rules. I say toss out the VPs alltogether! If you're a crazy person and try to throw over the road from 4 then it is your own fault for trying to make an extremely difficult shot. I also think that Bill is right about newer, inexperienced players and wanting to avoid what may

a) damage their disc

b) damage somebody else's property

c) lose their disc



All of the holes that would have a potential VP rule have many routes to the pin. It is up to the individual to decide which route works best for their level of skill (and will get them to the basket in the least number of strokes! :))

[jim]

I've been thinking about this lately. Let me know if you do not agree with the updated OB rules for Bevier:

- Landing IN or ACROSS either road (McAree or Yorkhouse) is OB.  To be in-bounds, you must be completely on the gravel shoulder (close-side, not far-side) or up against the concrete curb. Any portion of the disc on asphalt surface is OB.

- Any disc that stays at rest above 6-feet, six-inches is OB. You throw from directly under (or close as possible) where the disc was hung up.

- Holes using Basket #2: Over tennis courts is OK; landing in the tennis courts is OB. Landing on the basketball courts is OB and the thrower gets spanked.

- Holes using baskets #4 & 5: Street is OB but no vertical plane rule anymore - except for tournaments. I do not want casual players or low Ams throwing into oncoming traffic period.  Landing across the street is also OB.

- Hole #10 - you may throw over the road but may not land in or over the road.

- For the BLAST, OB near the houses on the east side of the park will be clearly marked with string, signs, and spraypaint.



OKEY-DOKEY?

[jim]

You just described half the courses in Michigan!

And BTW, you have to pay extra for me to get on my belly.......

so....

get IN me belly!!!!!!1

[jim]

Yeah right, Jay. You're the one using a baby duckling as a namesake.

Bruce, you're nuts. Are you planning on rolling on the streets (as long as it rolls in-bounds)? Sounds like fun!

[CEValkyrie]

Yes, we can throw over the tennis court, over the road on #4, #13, #10, & #5.

[CEValkyrie]

I agree with Mirth. One of the biggest complaints from non club members playing in our tournaments is not being able to throw over the road. I also think that it is a judgement call. Players always ask why can we throw over #10 & not #4 & #5. I sometimes wonder if my own disc is flying over the road (#5). If we do anything I think is should be one or the other. Or one rule for Rec & Ams & one for Adv & Pro

[CEValkyrie]

Ha, I would have love to seen her face.

[vanmaster_b]

I would have to suggest consistency for the road rule: either no one is allowed to throw over any road, or everyone is allowed to throw over any road. Most beginners, I've found, are leary about throwing over the road anyway. They don't want their disc to get run over or hit by a car, and they also don't want to deal with an angry driver. Others who have played for a while, know their limitations and are either able to safely throw over the road (most of the time), or know that they don't want to risk it.

As for the tennis courts, if the objective is to keep fewer discs from hitting tennis players (or just interrupting tennis play), I am not convinced that the vertical plane rule is that effective. I like the idea of having no vertical planes, not to mention the fact that you always have to rely on someone else's judgement.

[Myk]

By vertical plane you mean the out of bounds for crossing the tennis courts on 2 and the road on 4 and 5?

[myndcraft]

Regardless of that being a movie quote your a very strange little man Jim Klem :-) Oh and I do mean little LOL

[myndcraft]

Jim, yes I have a baby duckinling but look what his message is :-)

Thats in reply to your belly comment :-)



Oh and check yer email :-)

[Jon Brakel]

Snort!

[Bruce Brakel]

I was looking for a thread to post this story on.  Roads and impassible vertical planes seemed like the best place, especially since the thread is six months dead.



As many of you know, I live in south-east Michigan.  I live a couple of miles from work, and in good weather I like to walk to work a couple of times per week.



Walking anywhere in these parts is difficult because it is frowned on by the pooh-bahs of the local indiginous religion.  They worship cars.  They have these huge, village-sized temples where they design, test and manufacture cars.  They don't build a lot of sidewalks.   None of the faithful swerve to give a little room to an infidel pedestrian or cyclist around here.



I found a reasonably safe, though sidewalk deficient, way to walk to work that winds through the neighborhood, a local park, the county water, sewer and maintenance facility, the county children's home grounds and finally across a five lane highway to the county government campus.  This route is pretty cool because I can get in many holes of object golf.  



Unfortunately, after 9/11 the children's home got sensitive about security and that route was shut down for regular, casual travel.  I can wave my badge and talk my way past security on the day my car is in the shop, but it is not something I can do at will.

[Bruce Brakel]

There is a large park occupying much of the space directly between my home and the county complex.  The near half of the park is heavily developed for recreation, with a waterpark, tennis courts, a BMX track, a tobbogan run and so on, sprinkled among several small swamps and ponds.  The back half is a mix of more swamp and a tanglewood forest.



I once, like either half of Lewis and Clark, and without the help of Sacagewea, explored those swamps and tanglewood forests backwards, looking for a Northwest Passage all the way from work to home.  A muddy mile later I came to the impassable vertical plane:  an eight foot high chain link fence with the exposed points on top and no top bar.  Unless you are being chased by a junkyard dog, this is a dead end, especially if you are wearing a suit while that dog is not chasing you.



The other day, while cruising in car down the five lane highway that seperates the park from the county campus, I saw something new:  Off in the tanglewood forest there was something that looked oddly like a you-are-here park map on a post.  So I'm thinking they must have carved jogging trails through the tanglewood and now I am motivated to find a way under, over or through that fence, even if that involves coming out at night with wire cutters.



Today Diana took her car to the shop and then took my car to Ann Arbor to go to the symphony matinee and then play a little disc golf with ten or twelve juniors.  So I decided to walk the length of the fence at the end of the day, looking for a pre-existing security breach.  Jon and I know fences and their limitations from our adolescent misadventures and I just know that there must be a reasonably safe and legal way through.



I found several places where Jim Klem could get through on his belly, but I'm no Jim Klem, especially in the belly.  And then, eureka!  Obscured by bushes 20 feet deep I find an old double-wide gated entrance.  The gate is locked but it has a top bar and also typical chain link C-clasp in the middle.  I put one foot up on the locked clasp, barely slip through the gap between the gates and hop down.  My heart starts beating fast and I have to tell myself, "This is not the local factory yard and you aren't 16 years old!"



So now I have to find my way through the tanglewood and back to the jogging path.  This becomes a bit complicated when I come to a rain swollen skank water creek, and a bit comical when I come to a muddy hill.  I wound up falling and sliding a good thirty feet on my hands and feet, but I stopped just short of the creek and kept the suit clean!  When I got to the map I realized that there is a route that does not require me to cross the creek or climb the muddy hill and now I have the most excellent way to practice upshots in the woods and walk to work!

[Bruce Brakel]

I walked to and from work on the new route yesterday.  Then, using the car odometer, I measured the "hole" from the north end of the county complex to my office door.  It was just about a mile!  It is a pretty challenging hole too, with four o.b. roads to cross, a creek and a low fence.  A par 20, I suppose, but its hard to count that high!



Monday, if it's not raining, I'll play the hole with a scorecard (tally sheet) and report my score.

[Bruce Brakel]

If anyone gets all the way to Detroit this year, like maybe you wanted to play the Great Lakes Open somewhere you could stay for free and eat Diana's home cooking, we'll play the mile-long-hole from north to south and the loser buys Cokes at the employee break room in the prosecutor's building.



On a weekend evening there would be almost no chance of incurring the two-stroke penalty for hitting a parked car.