Unknown Rules

[tjdub42]

Two things that I overheard at IOS #1 (Sunday) regarding rules:

  Headphones:  Are these legal during a round?
  Disc Modifications:  Other than dying, stamp removal, or repeated throws into a tree, can you modify a disc from it's factory specs?

Thnx.

[pickax]

Headphones are fine as long as they a) are not a distraction and b) the player is able to fulfill all of his duties as a player.

If the headphones are loud enough to be a distraction, a courtesy warning can be issued. Keep in mind even a low level can be a distraction to some players. If they can be heard by anyone other than the player wearing them, there is a possibility that the player can be asked to turn them down.

What types of duties am I referring to in b)? A player needs to be able to hear his card mates to respond to requests for score, looking for a lost disc, stepping out of the way, etc. In addition, the player better be able to hear "Fore" called when an errant shot is heading towards him.

Disc modifications are covered in 802.01(C). You cannot add stickers, decals, etc. You can't paint it. You can't file off the bead, etc. Is there a specific type of modification that you are curious about or has come up?

[Bruce Brakel]

This is the rule:

C. Players may not make post-production modification of discs which alter their original flight characteristics. This rule does not forbid inevitable wear and tear from usage during play or the moderate sanding of discs to smooth molding imperfections or scrape marks. Discs excessively sanded or painted with a material of detectable thickness are illegal. See sections 802.01 D, E and F.

Note the noun: "players."  A manufacturer or vendor can put a sticker on a disc.  A dye guy can de-dome a disc for you in the dying process, and it is still legal. 

Under the rules, slamming a disc into a tree or into the ground to break it in is illegal for you to do.  Nothing in the rule would prevent you from buying a disc that was pre-slammed!     I've done that too, but usually that guy would hire Jamie Mosier to pre-slam his discs. 

[pickax]

That said, nothing in the rules prevents you from going to a tightly wooded course and practicing rollers and shots through 10" gaps between tress. The easiest way to break a disc in is to lend it to a friend who has never played for a round.

[J.R.]

This is the rule:

C. Players may not make post-production modification of discs which alter their original flight characteristics. This rule does not forbid inevitable wear and tear from usage during play or the moderate sanding of discs to smooth molding imperfections or scrape marks. Discs excessively sanded or painted with a material of detectable thickness are illegal. See sections 802.01 D, E and F.

Note the noun: "players."  A manufacturer or vendor can put a sticker on a disc.  A dye guy can de-dome a disc for you in the dying process, and it is still legal. 

Under the rules, slamming a disc into a tree or into the ground to break it in is illegal for you to do.  Nothing in the rule would prevent you from buying a disc that was pre-slammed!     I've done that too, but usually that guy would hire Jamie Mosier to pre-slam his discs. 

But there is also rule 802.01 (A):

"Discs used in play must meet all of the conditions set forth in the Official PDGA Technical Standards Document. See section 805 B for disc technical standards."

and the techincal standards doc says:

"To be used in PDGA competition, discs must...(6) be essentially as produced, without any post-production modifications which affect the weight or flight characteristics..."

No mention of "players" here.  So, I would think this would proclude post production modification by non players.

That said, I think this rule is too vague.  It does not define the primary phrase, "post production modification," clearly.  I think it is debatable whether intentionally breaking in a disc is prohibited or not given this wording.  (though it probably is)  Moreover, does the PDGA intend to prohibit "tuning" discs, bending them to alter the stability.  It's not at all clear to me if this would constitute a "modification."

Thoughts?

[Jon Brakel]

Tuning a disc is always allowed. Procedures on how to properly tune a disc have been published by Disc Golf World with no comment from anyone on the rules committee. I think its just a generally accepted fact that discs get bent all the time and they need to be tuned to be thrown properly. I don't think you've altered the disc unless you have tuned the disc so much that it can't be tuned back.

Disc golf's rules are not nearly as clear as ball golf's rules. Because of this many of our rules are up for interpretation. Personally I prefer this than to have an encyclopedia sized rule and interpretation book.

[Bruce Brakel]

The rule quoted above drops out the word "player" but tosses in a big weasel word "essentially."  I think a disc can suffer a lot of abuse and still be essentially what the manufacturer produced.  If is a beat up whatever it was before you beat it up, it is essentially whatever it was.

What the PDGA definately does not allow without submitting the disc for approval is any kind of systematic modification of the disc, like the way Dr. Fred used to produce factored discs on a lathe by taking off some of the rim or bead. 

[J.R.]

Yeah, adding "essentially" makes the phrase fairly indeterminate.  Oh, the joys of language.   

I suppose we all basically know what the PDGA intends with the rule. I kind of agree with you Jon.  Though it is nice to have an absolutely clear definition, language simply isn't that precise and it is nice that the rules are short and simple (if unclear )